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TOS had a Briefing Room. But still not a fan. But be realistic. This episode was better than all of season 1 combined. Not perfect, but MUCH better. The first season ready room set was repurposed into a science lab for later in the season. So it may not be directly connected to the bridge, but this new meeting room takes the place of the old ready room for talking to his officers.

Loving this season so far. The show feels like it has found its groove, the writing is assured, performances are excellent as always. Really hoping Anson Mount sticks around after this season. Agree that the episode would have benefitted with an extra mins runtime, as the planet storyline felt a little rushed. Otherwise, excellent ep.

The Stories of Haven

I actually thought they spent plenty of time on that planet. The more time you spend on a pre-warp world the more the danger of contamination. Otherwise enjoyed the classic Star Trek feel of this episode and I love the dynamic forming between Burnham and Pike. Religion is made up fiction and absurd. Talking snakes? Being alive in the sky after dying? Just dumb.

Religion is primitive poison. The problem with season 2 so far is Alex Kurtzman. He has made this into JJ Abrams fast action all the time star trek. Trek got it right in Interesting note… maybe Pike heard this hell fable from his professor father and his teaching of comparative religion. Nice tie in by the writers. Yes, the Bible contains fables.

By definition stories that are not historically accurate are fiction. Dictionaries are fun! Fun stuff this bible! And I thought the only fun fiction book with a talking snake was Harry Potter! That anything not historically or empirically verifiable is useless? That the law codes in the Bible originated in patriarchal, homophobic societies in which slavery was taken for granted? Of course, but there are also laws to release slaves after specified years, that require crops be left unharvested for the poor, that limit what damages can be demanded for an injury, and that call for all debts to be annulled every 50 years.

It seems to me that an unavoidable question is what presuppositions — whether favorable or critical — folks bring to their reading of a text and what principles of interpretation guide their reading. You seem to say that anyone who gives any weight to anything not empirically demonstrable is irrational. Is it really all that simple? Ever hear of the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle? People who believe in invisible magic cloud people are sadly silly.

Santa is not real. Not complicated. Painfully obvious. Not even worthy of a debate among adults. Any book that commands people to enslave and sell other people, has rules for making the rape of women OK and, again, killing LGBT people with rocks, is just not worth keeping. Toss the Bible, Quran and Torrah in the recycling bin and start over minus all the abracadabra stuff.

Dogmatism, whether inspired by blind faith in religion or other human endeavors, tends to destroy, not create, imho. I appreciate your insight Elrond. I wish there was more open mindedness and tolerance in the world today. Some may have problems with that, but I wonder if that realization would be unifying. Thanks, Captain! I wonder the same thing. Not as dramatic as intelligent contact, but still monumental. What effect would that have? Yes, Cap, I have the exact same thoughts.

I hope that the discovery of any kind of extraterrestrial life from microbial to intelligent happens in my lifetime. What a momentous event that would be for humanity. And your comment is highly offensive to those who do believe. Then again fortunately I believe everyone is entitled to an opinion and can be tolerant. Though I will add I once felt the same way… then I survived an accident that should have killed me. That made me question whether there was something more. Then my family escaped a fire that destroyed my home with no injuries despite the fact that the fire ravaged our home before we even awoke.

You might have concluded if you had the same experiences that you and your family had beaten the odds. Who cares if they worship a god. Is it hurting you if they do. The new season ist just better than the first one so far. Characters are relatable, writing is better, pace is good, stories interesting. It is more entertaining, and feels more rounded overall. No, the prime directive is not meant to protect some hidden structure in the universe, even if whole civilizations have to perish.

The prime directive is meant to protect those very societies in their social and cultural developments. And is the result of some post-colonial reflection in science fiction. Of course you can divert a space rock that might otherwise endanger their homeworld.

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I know canon is inconsistent on this, but I blame plot-serving arbitrariness. The Third World War, breaking the warp barrier, and first contact seemed far in the future when Star Trek First Contact came out in , but now they seem too close for comfort. Now, the writers seem to be doubling down on a timeline created over 20 years ago. Some may prefer to see Star Trek as an alternate timeline, but I believe that kills some of the beauty of the franchise.

Oh, no! Star Trek canon is not infallible! Seriously, Gorbs, fwiw, I really like your comment about a hopeful future no, WW3, please , and really, really agree with your insight about wanting that optimistic view to be OUR future, even if incorrect on some details. My thought is this, when it comes to Star Trek I prefer to use my imagination rather than base everything on reality. It is a fable that shows a potential future I think.

I agree that there was no need to specifically refer to exact dates regarding WW3 and so on. They are almost overdoing the adherence to Canon in that regard. Lol So I guess you believe WW3 is inevitable? I hope for mankind that we could possibly make it towards a Star Trek future without the need for a nuclear winter and mill dead. Are we ready or not? I read a book on the show that explained that season actually has an arc and makes sense if you watch the eps in the right order something I never knew while spending decades making fun of it.

Dear Space Lawyers, Does the Prime Directive even apply to New Eden, since they are not indigenous to the planet but are humans taken there by some outside force, and are only at 19th century tech level due to lack of resources? I bet the Federation will look into the colony after the report is filed and debate it. It raises the question about a civilization who becomes aware of the existence of life on other planets without necessarily developing warp capability.

Certainly when the Vulcans landed on Earth, few if any even realized the warp barrier had been broken, much less that it heralded the arrival of alien life, yet the Vulcans just plopped down and barged into an alien culture without any real understanding of what they were walking into.

It was a very dramatic cinematic moment, but hardly realistic in the scope of things. It was a more realistic portrayal of probably what the Federation does when making first contact with a new world by researching them and get a sense how well they would be able handle the idea of meeting a new species.

What I particularly appreciate about this episode is that the behavior and dialogues of the characters make sense.

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They hesitantly get back to using the spore drive and decide to make an exception to General Order 1. We have Tilly acting reckless like in the Short Trek, and Stamets discussing meeting Culber in the mycelial space with both due skepticism and emotional weight. They forgot to connect it to the omega particle and red matter. I will start by saying I like the episode. That being said, I know the religion vs science debate will continue on here. I have wrote this twice trying to get my thoughts out knowing it can be a hot topic. Personally, I think religion needs to be represented in Trek.

Why have Trek represent everyone from race, sexuality, sexual orientation and backgrounds from all over the world but if you are religious, Trek is not for you. I liked the episode where is brings all religions together. Just my 2 cents. I apologize if I offended anyone. Just trying to say, there is room for everyone. Because largely, Trek has portrayed an agnostic worldview, and has depicted a future of human society that has at the very least minimized religion.

That said, Voyager had a religious first officer, and of course as has been mentioned, DS9 represented alien religions as metaphors for our own. Agreed, Aftergurn. Looks like Disco is going to tackle the topic less indirectly. I wonder if Burnham and Spock are going to represent respectively, ironically the empirical and transcendent aspects, though not in extreme forms. I was raised by devoutly Christian Star Trek fans. The slanted tablet device Tilly was using with the blocky clear yellow memory card was very TOS, I thought.

LOL I noticed that too. But little things like that is cool and updated. I can totally buy it. Yep similar memory cards have shown up in season one as well. Lorca had a memory card holder with a few of them in it on his standing desk. Here we have the exact opposite in many ways: Pike is the thoughtful, level-headed commander who we not just remember from, but who clearly appears shaped by his experience in The Cage in not dismissing anything at first hand; a justification for tech spore drive that is rooted in the story rather than the other way round; a mystery that speaks to us in ways beyond just adding lore to this fictitious universe.

Vulcan Soul, I really like your description of Pike. Thanks, too, to CmdrR for that great Picard quote. Pike clearly showed why he will end up permanently disabled saving lives. I liked that bit, and it was yet another example of rushed storytelling. His example of self-sacrifice and his injury were about 30 seconds to a minute long. It would have been stronger to linger on that, have a back-and-forth between Burnham and Saru while Pike is in surgery, and his recovery is in doubt.

Afterburn — not to mention reconcile a bit better with canon as to why there was anything left of Pike, or anyone else, to save after a phaser on overload, which only a few years earlier on Talos, threatened to kill the entire landing party. It was however a fine show of his selflessness as Who Cares points out, which will be the case when he saves others and becomes permanently disabled by delta rays. I think Afterburn is right — the phaser was probably set on a low setting. Just never liked that series. Some Trekkies may even have forgotten how he got put in the chair. Reading this is just too hard to handle.

Maybe a little less generalization on your part would be appropriate, NCC. Thank goodness for Discovery fans eh? Yeah, Discovery has wonderful fans. I mean WTF?! It was a solid episode but I really wanted to know more about Terralysium and its inhabitants besides Jacob and the All Mother who was completely one note. I think they still are targeting around a 60 run time with commercials. First — shout out to finally showing us beautiful Discovery shots.

We debate it like Trek fans, with references to previous stories, rules, etc. Anyone out here watch it with someone like that? Then Saru would have had to experience something parallel but in reverse to what he experienced on his home planet. And randomly: while we consider Star Trek to be against religion, what it is really against, and which there are a few defenders for, is animistic devotions. And Pike is very nice about it.

Poster would probably have a point, except that the notion was absolutely brilliant and therefore trumps canon, much as, for Ruk, Survival transcends programming or words to that effect. Yes that is the part I meant. I agree Menagerie was brilliant, but slightly different than Cage in how it ended.

My teenage son rarely ever watched TOS despite my best efforts, but once we watched both parts of Menagerie and he was riveted. Said it was the best episode of Star Trek he ever saw. At the end of The Cage, Vina is left with the illusion of Pike, and the illusion of her own crippled body restored. At the end of the Menagerie, they merely do not show us the last bit of what Pike originally saw which is perfectly fine since the entire episode was abridged anyway. Instead, they show us that the real Pike has been given the illusion of perfect health and now replaces the illusion of himself Vina was originally left with.

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The only mystery that remains now, is how and when did Spock get in touch with the Talosians to plan it, which presumably DISC is going to answer. The on-the-planet stuff felt like something from an earlys, made-in-Canada, cheapo syndicated series, complete with bad acting from Sheila MacCarthy.

Discovery feels more and more like 90s Trek, in a bad way — and I wonder if Frakes is part of the problem. Well its only been two episodes its hard to judge either way. And to be honest this is just what they do in Star Trek. Have you watched it? This episode is probably the most different of the entire run in terms of both tone and story. But this one seems to be the most favorite episode by fans so far by a mile. Even this board seems to have almost unanimous praise for it even if not everyone is in love with it, nearly everyone likes it at least.

This one episode captivated all of those and why the fanbase seems more positive on it. This is bringing me back to Star Trek of old! Though I liked the premiere a bit more at the time. I said this on the other thread but if this was just a Voyager episode in season 5 or something I doubt people would be praising it AS much because its something thats been done on the others so often.

And its not a trope everyone likes in Trek. They are trying to make it clear Discovery is very much part of the PU. Very true. That sort of thing kind of grinds my gears. That said, anything that can bring around some of the critics to give the show a more open look is fine by me. But of course its still early, I can easily fall back into my more cynical self by episode 5 or something. Okay, this episode only affirms me in my previous idea: kill Burnham and put Owosekun in her place. Joann gets three whole sentences in a single episode and she already feels more alive than than Michael ever did.

Is it a character thing, or an actor thing? I know Martin-Green is supposed to be a good actress even though I never saw her in anything before ; but in Discovery, it seems like she has only three expressions and keeps rotating them randomly. Might as well give Trump your idea to fund the wall. Triggered much? I feel SMG is an excellent actor with a wide range. Anger, disbelief, puzzlement, realization, grief, fear, resolve all at play in a span of moments. Tough to do with the overlay of having been raised in Vulcan society.

I realize, of course, that such judgements are subjective. But I love little stuff like this to make it feel part of the franchise as a whole. Fantastic episode. I would love to see the season end with the identity of the red angel being ambiguous. Was it an angel of God or an alien being? Leave it up to the viewer. Looking forward to more!!! Fans would riot if they imply it was really an angel in biblical terms. It was a joke! Even when they have suggested other supernatural things like ghosts or possible Gods like Apollo on TOS its always comes back to more aliens lol.

This could be a first but seriously doubt it. The Discovery requires the spore drive to travel that far but the light from that part of the galaxy would have taken over 51, years to hit their eyeballs in the Alpha Quadrant. Ach du lieber! Is anyone paying attention to Physics!!!??? I think that the fact they did all appear at the same time is what has Starfleet curious. A solid second episode but the short run time of less than 45 minutes was a disappointment after the premiere — as a result the episode felt rushed.

I like all of the characters on the show except for the S1 Klingons and have been a fan of Sonequa Martin-Green since her Walking Dead days, but I suspect Saru will become the only iconic character from the series. Doug Jones is a gem. Please, that should be required Trekmovie. I will be a bit more in focus each episode. We came, we saw, we lit the place up. Notify me of. I allow to use my email address and send notification about new comments and replies you can unsubscribe at any time.

January 25, pm. And regarding saving them from the ship….

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That was brought up in the review. True but I have a feeling that might be relevant to the season long story arc, unfortunately. DSC needs better writing period. Substance replaced by spectacle. January 26, am. Thomas W.

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January 26, pm. January 27, am. She referred me to someone else, where I left several messages with no response. I finally, just this week, sent a long email to the Cancer Society, telling them who I was and what I wanted just to leave our marketing postcards at their events. Received a long form letter back with basically an application to partner with them… lots of red tape, etc.

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